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Life, Health & The Universe
Life, health and the universe are all connected. In a world where we are more connected than ever, we have become disconnected from ourselves. In this podcast, along with guests, I discuss ideas in a celebration of life, an exploration of health and some wonderment of the universe.
Contact Nadine: https://lifehealththeuniverse.podcastpage.io/contact
Life, Health & The Universe
Transforming Stress through the Power of the Vagus Nerve
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What if a single nerve could revolutionise the way you manage stress? This episode brings you the remarkable journey of Marie Young, a stress management coach and embodiment teacher who transformed her life from corporate grind and acting to holistic health leadership. Marie shares her profound struggles with depression and lack of fulfilment despite outward success. Her inspiring story offers invaluable insights into maintaining balance in both professional and personal realms.
Ever felt the crushing weight of burnout while juggling demanding careers and personal dreams? Join us as we explore Marie’s challenging path of relocating to a new city and navigating the high pressures of performing arts, which led to significant burnout. Discover the transformative power of yoga and meditation in understanding one's personal dharma and achieving mental resilience. Through this engaging conversation, we uncover the importance of experiential wisdom over mere intellectual understanding and how fast-paced living can hinder our ability to process life’s experiences holistically.
Can conscious leadership and intention setting truly transform the workplace? Marie Young enlightens us on the evolving wellness culture in corporate environments, from giants like Apple and Meta to smaller companies striving to integrate well-being programs. We delve into the importance of balancing being and doing, setting intentions, and the critical role of the autonomic nervous system in stress management.
Learn how small positive changes can lead to significant long-term impacts on individual and organisational wellness, all while exploring the fascinating intersection of ancient wisdom and modern health practices. This episode promises to equip you with high-performance wellness strategies to live a more balanced and fulfilling life.
You can find Marie's full profile in our Guest Directory https://lifehealththeuniverse.podcastpage.io/person/marie-young
Welcome to Life, health and the Universe, bringing you stories that connect us, preventative and holistic health practices to empower us and esoteric wisdom to enlighten us. We invite you to visit our website, where you can access the podcast, watch on YouTube and find all of our guests in the guest directory. Visit lifehealththeuniversepodcastpageio. Now let's get stuck into this week's episode. Burnout, especially for women, is a real thing, and we've had more than one guest on the show sharing their experiences of it. It's pretty well acknowledged that workloads are becoming increasingly demanding and that there are often disproportionate demands on women. Thankfully, the stories we've heard are from women overcoming burnout, and their stories have us feeling uplifted and empowered.
Speaker 1:Preventing the negative impacts of stress and overwhelm are essential for our health and wellbeing and need to be taken seriously. With the support and guidance and expertise from coaches like our guest today, marie Young, we can learn how to make a positive impact in our professional as well as our personal lives. Marie is a stress management coach, life coach, embodiment teacher and a body resilience mentor. She's been teaching yoga and meditation for over 20 years and has experimented with many different healing modalities, most recently studying toning the ventral branch of the vagus nerve to reduce stress and create a sense of wellbeing in the body. Before teaching and coaching, she worked in both corporate America and professional acting. Marie is a certified professional coach who specializes in helping people reach their peak mental performance, and for more than 20 years she's taught her innovative meditation, stress management and productivity techniques to audiences around the world, including at companies like Facebook, apple and.
Speaker 2:Amazon, to name but a few. Marie, thank you so much for joining us today. How are you? I feel great. After that intro, I'm glad I recorded that.
Speaker 1:Thank you so much for joining us today. How are you? I feel great. After that intro, I'm doing really well. It's great to be on your show. Thank you so much. Yes, thank you for being here. We had a couple of hiccups getting ourselves organized, but we're here today. Do you want to tell us? Give us a little? I mean, I just kind of did an intro, obviously, so do you want to fill in any gaps? Is there anything I missed or that you want to add to that little intro, or do you just want to get stuck in?
Speaker 2:Yeah, no, I thought that was really, really comprehensive. Yeah, yeah, I, I think it was great. Um, we can just uh, just as a reminder to myself um, I, we can definitely talk about the ventral branch of the vagus nerve. That's something I'm really enthusiastic about. Um, I think, single-handedly, that's, you know, that's been what's given me the most bang for my buck, um, in terms of stress management and reconnecting.
Speaker 1:So, um, yeah, I would say let's, let's focus on that whenever is a good time yeah, cool, that sounds good, and I've got that written down in my notes actually, so I'm gonna save it. Oh yeah, it's a big bit it's a big bit.
Speaker 2:It's a fun bit For the big finish.
Speaker 1:Tell us a little bit about your story, because you have a like 20 years ago I guess, and maybe more recently. You have a background in acting, but, like you suggest in some of the material that I've read on your website, that you were overwhelmed, you were stressed and potentially a little bit unfulfilled with what this you know a seemingly good job and successful. You know life. To people on the outside may look, but yeah, you were experiencing those things. So, like, what was that like for you? And like how did you segue into what you're doing now?
Speaker 2:oh, golly um just a little question to start.
Speaker 2:I'll start with um origin story. Um so um, my family is like on both sides I come from agrarian roots, I guess Not this gen, not my generation, but a couple generations back on both sides, like you know, farmers. My mom's mom was first generation Irish American, which I think is a little unusual. Mom was first generation Irish American, which I think is a little unusual. And so you know, just, you know, kind of almost right off the boat, and my dad's dad, my dad's family had, you know, they were farmers and school teachers for for a long time. So and I I sort of started looking at that as I, you know, I think as women and probably men as well, but I think as women, especially when you become a mom, like you're very interested in the, your lineage and where you come from, and you know and and passing that on and giving that information, at least for me. That's my experience.
Speaker 2:So what I was finding with that and what I would listen to my mom's and my grandmother's talk, that there was some sadness in our family on both sides, you know, I think commonly referred to as depression. That did sort of carry over. Some of that may have been biological, some of it, you know, in large part was circumstantial. You can sort of point to the differences and in my lifetime, I think kind of the big, maybe sort of psychic wound or you know what sort of was hard for me and kind of put me on the healing path, was my mom and dad divorced and we relocated about a thousand miles away from everything that I've known. And we relocated about 1000 miles away from everything that I've known and it was a big city and and my mom had to go to work. So, you know, I effectively kind of lost both parents. But because we're strong stock, we, you know, I, we figured out a way to kind of bootstrap and and grit through it. I did, but in my 20s, I think, is when it caught up to me. So, um, you know, there was, you know, some real depression and um, uh, kind of malaise. And you know the education system over here, uh, at least when I was going to school, is it's, it's good and I went to good schools, but it doesn't really teach how you know kind of what we're referring to now as self-care and um, really, uh, you know, knowing myself, you, you can know what you're good in at school, but it doesn't necessarily translate to, to to taking care of yourself and treating yourself not just as you know, to taking care of yourself and treating yourself not just, as you know, intellectually gifted or sports gifted, so that kind of led. That did lead me to the self development books or, as they were called, self help. And then that, eventually, in around 2000 and 2001,.
Speaker 2:Yoga got really big, I think, worldwide, in the West Um, and especially here in Austin, the Austin area, and so, um, when I took really my first yoga class, I had just had a huge aha moment. Um, just in terms of it, it did something to my nervous system, which I, you know, I, I think back to the ventral branch of the vagus nerve. It, it works that, and, um, also the breath work, um, it just, it reconnected me to, I think, what you could call the higher self. Um, that's what part, part of what yoga does is. It's translated in means to yoke, and it yokes the individual with the divine. It yokes body, mind and spirit. You know it is an integrative practice and so that just kind of set me on on a course for for my, my work today, and I. I taught yoga for a good many years and then that segged into meditation, which offered an even deeper experience with breath and breath work, and those two really influenced me in terms of developing my own set of what are body resilience techniques and stress reduction techniques.
Speaker 1:Cool, yeah, so did you. That's a great um story and a great intro, thank you. And there's a long one. Oh, I love a long, love a long story. What it's all about, right, um, yeah well I think sharing stories is like it's part of what um I love about this podcast yeah um, yeah, okay.
Speaker 1:So you yeah. Um, golly gosh, sorry, no, it's okay. I was just thinking about like. I know you said like in your 20s you kind of felt you got into that self-help and you found that yoga and meditation really served you. But was there a point where you did feel like the pressures of life? Was it just that in the 20s, or did you have like something going on later in life as well? I mean, 20 just seems so young for that to happen.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, I guess I was lucky that it happened early because, you know, then it gave me, um, an opportunity to to really look inward, which is, you know where all the good answers come from. Um, yeah, my life has always been pretty busy, like, for whatever reason. I have a lot of interests. Um, I, uh, austin, texas, is a huge tech hub and has been for many years now. Um, a lot of high tech and um, I worked in high tech for many years, um, enjoyed it, but, you know, it was kind of the day job, um and so, and you probably had people on your show and probably know this from your own life and work is like I feel like there's a real intersection between healers and creative people and um, so I feel like you know I'm I'm in that notch as well.
Speaker 2:Um and so, for me, the creativity came from acting. Austin had a huge, um, and still does, a huge independent film scene and theater scene, um and so that was a great way to uh express myself. However, what I'm noticing now is, you know how you can kind of look behind science 2020, look back. I think what it did is it ultimately led me to move out to Los Angeles, where I discovered and did my first yoga training, and I think that's really where it was leading me, because when I think about now the somatic experiences I was having in my body during acting, they were actually it put me in a real fear state, like I don't know that it was the match for me in terms of the create, you know, the creativity that I was seeking. However, you know we can miss the mark and still, you know, learn a lot and it's still be great, and in that case it really was. And I think the yoga teachers in LA were the ones I took with were top notch, just like amazing. Some great ones here in Austin now, but I think at that time they were largely out there because it had such a huge scene out there, because it had such a huge scene.
Speaker 2:So where I was facing burnout is like giving my all to tech and then also having this other life that I was pursuing as well, and the stresses that came from performing in front of people for my personality type, which is maybe you know, I was just it just kind of locked me in fear, in an, in an, a sympathetic state in the nervous system, right, and so I was in Los Angeles, faced a huge, huge burnout. Um it, you know it's hard. It was hard out there. I, if I was going to do it, I wish I had gone earlier. Um, but you know I was in my thirties at the time and that's that's a hard time. You know it's changing a little bit. But, um, and you know I, I look back on it I was like maybe if I had stayed, because they say it takes a good 10 years, okay, and um, yeah, um, but it just it wasn't, it wasn't meant to be at that time.
Speaker 1:So, um, go ahead no, I was just gonna say I kind of love that story because it's almost like you you had these aspirations and you moved somewhere, but it was uh, what do we call it? The dharma. The life path like that leads you and it's not always where you expect. Like you go I know, I want to be an actor and you put all of your life energy into it, move to a different place and you're like, and then yoga pops up as a solution to the ways that you were feeling. But it's, and it's like is that what the universe had in mind for you all along? But you just had to go that direction to. Yeah, I love those stories.
Speaker 2:Yeah, exactly Like I do too. Like it does help me. I was like no, I think. I mean don't know for a hundred percent, but I have a pretty good sense that that's what was going on. And especially, you know, when you move somewhere else, you get perspective, in a way that you on where you grew up and the good and the bad of where you grew up, and you know the holes, what was missing. So it gave me that too, which you know the, the holes, um, what was missing. So it gave me that too, which you know is priceless, um, I wish I could have learned that more easily, like a bit stubborn Um, but you know, uh, it was an important lesson to learn and I think, um, the just the, the teachers I took with and that, that, like you said, discovering that dharma, that was with that.
Speaker 1:So yeah yeah and and the. Yeah, I think we all feel that like that about our life lessons, don't we?
Speaker 2:whether things happen for good or bad.
Speaker 1:It's like in hindsight we can go ah, that's what that was all about, but in. But you're like did I really have to go through all of that? Yeah, wouldn't it have been just easier for someone?
Speaker 2:to tell me yeah, yeah, some people you know I would, I get, I think I get the spiritual, spiritual information. I get it really well intellectually, like, yes, of course, like aha, and I think that when I was younger I convinced myself that that translated to wisdom. But that's really just knowledge, right, like I got the knowledge, I didn't have the wisdom which is the experiential piece, and so, yeah, that you know. So I crashed pretty hard. I think maybe it was adrenal burnout, maybe it was just, um, you know, I think when things move so fast, you're you're not processing them in an integrated way, and so it just, in my case, it just feels like it caught up with me. And so I moved back to the Austin area and was was able, with yoga and meditation, to to really like process that through my body in an integrated way and that, that that served me.
Speaker 1:So Do you? Oh God, I keep getting these questions on the tip of my tongue, and then they've gone again.
Speaker 2:No worries.
Speaker 1:I get that all the time. What, what was it? What did it look like for you to when you had burnout, like when you like? Is it just exhaustion, like next level? Is it an emotional, is it physical?
Speaker 2:Yeah, um, I think for me, burnout is, um, it is mostly a mental thing, because what I've discovered about my mind and I think this is true for most bright people, certainly women, because you know we're processing things more holistically, our brains do so. I look at it as like parallel processing. My one of my minors was computer science and you know their serial processing and I guess my experience has been that men can process more linearly, you know they can compartmentalize and process more linearly. Women have maybe a more 360 approach. There's certainly value to both.
Speaker 2:I'm not, I'm not like a, like you know, I think the masculine is extremely important and men and the masculine, let me say Um, but I and I think some people just have, depending on what's going on in their brain or how are their makeup, and yoga actually speaks to this will just have more going on in their mind, just like it just circles. You know, more quickly and I think my mind has natively just a lot of that noise. Um, you know, because I, in talking with my sister, she's and you know, I mean we share a lot of the same DNA, but her, her makeup, or either her makeup or her, um, you know, uh, you know, obviously, what she's been through, like she's not not put herself through so much, like she's just much more like hey, you don't have to do everything, kind of to me, um, you know she doesn't have that. She's's like, yeah, I mean, I, I, I get a lot of thoughts, and so then we would run down our thought list of like the last you know, we didn't exercise where it's like the last minute and she's like, oh yeah, you have a lot more, you know, and it's just like it can be random stuff, like a song lyric and then a to-do list and then a memory, you know. And so you know meditation will address that. You know, because with the noting practice you can just note the thoughts that come in.
Speaker 2:But you know, for whatever reason, I think, mine, you know, it's naturally there, and then if you put stress on top of that, then they're, they won't shut off, you know so. And then you just deal with an exhaustion, an exhaustion of a mental exhaustion, and for me that would lead to a lot of anxiety. Because if, if you're, if you know mentally you can't be there to like make the decisions in life, then you know that's like scary, yeah, so, wow, yeah, so I think for me it's more mental, because my body is, is pretty strong, I take good care of it, so, and I think that's also just my makeup and maybe my, my family's, like we were, we're kind of a robust, we're not, as you know, sickly family, so I never had to deal with that. So for me it hits me more mentally and then also like in the heart, like I, because the heart and the chakra system, you know, it's the mid, it integrates upper and lower, and so I, you know, and to lose heart, it integrates upper and lower and um, so I, you know, and to lose heart on something is to lose courage, right To be discouraged, and so, um, yeah, I will just those two go hand in hand. So that's the burnout piece for me.
Speaker 2:Um, so I just need practices that just kind of calm that and get me back into the heart, um and um, just reassuring um, you know, I would say, cause what I was finding with yoga, um, the way I was practicing it, which was Hatha, you know, the physical form of yoga, um, and they have other forms, um is in the West, it got. It got to be kind of a contact, not a contact sport, but you know like uh, you know um and uh, that didn't you know as I was getting older in my forties that just wasn't serving me anymore. Um, restorative is is fantastic yoga for me, I love that. Or yen Um, but sometimes don't have time or able to carve out the time to go and take those classes. So I was trying to approximate that. But with you know the, the work um that. But with you know the, the work um the information, the research that I had done on um the vagus nerve.
Speaker 1:Yes, so so you've been, you've spent a whole bunch of time in this kind of world of yoga meditation and you've taken it into um those sort of more corporate places that you've had.
Speaker 1:You've had some experience in corporate I, yeah, so um yeah, and so I'm just curious like, over 20 years you've been doing that, how has it changed? Or is it changing or things the same? They're getting worse, like are people becoming? Like, are people becoming more aware of the necessity to down-regulate, to manage their stress? Because I feel like for a lot of people it's kind of like a badge of honor, like if you're busy and you're stressed and you're working hard and you're doing all of the things, then you are worthy kind of thing, and if you're not doing those things, then maybe you're not living up to the standard that's expected of you. Yeah, have you seen that change over the last 20 years?
Speaker 2:I think I do think it is. Um, I just wanted to address really quickly. Um, I loved what you said. Like you talked about the do and the doing, um, and there's that model of like you put you do be and then do and then have right. So it's like who do you want to be? And and we're just not educated on on how to really think about that, like who do I want to be and that in this moment, in this life, and that's where, like intention setting comes in. But then also, I think that's also where self self care, commitment to self care comes in is like okay, because, for better and worse, like if I try and do too much and like push through, I go a little nuts.
Speaker 2:Frankly, I won't, will not lie. My husband can attest. Like he's like oh, you're doing too much, right, aren't you? And, and I was like, as a matter of fact, I am, yeah, so he's like well, you need to go walk your walk and and because, um, you know, I just I feel like as as humans, as spirits, um, when we get in touch you know, this is the B element like when we're in touch with the enormity of who we are, you're like wow, I have so much to offer. I am this light. I am, you know, made in the image of the creator, whatever that looks like you know for you, that looks like you know for you, and so I, I have all this to give, and so we automatically want to do, and so, you know, then we get on the do loop that way, and then if we see other people, then you know, then the do loop gets faster and faster. So, yeah, just just all the doing. Can you remind me what your question was?
Speaker 2:Oh, I would just ask you if you've seen a change in the way that people approach, especially in corporate, but in general, I guess, like with the people that you work with, I mean, I think that there, especially in HR of some of the larger companies, especially the ones based in California that are also here in Austin I've worked with, you know, apple on and Facebook, meta and Amazon, and they're all you know West coast companies they will, um, at least have like wellbeing coaches or you know they will um and and they'll have like I have friends who also work at Metta and they really do a lot to try to get them into wellness summits and make that available and and have committees on mindfulness and and yoga classes. You know, I do think that that is definitely different than when I started in tech. So I think it, I think it's changing. However, I think what's also changed is, you know, with the internet and how, how everything is, so you know knowledge is so easily available and with streaming and all of that, right Like. You know knowledge is so easily available and with streaming and all of that, right Like it. Just, I think that takes its toll on our minds. You know, because we're at screens all day, oh, totally, yeah, yeah, some stuff. You know stuff is coming in that way, know stuff is coming in that way, and so I think it is changing, but I think there are some challenges that we're having to deal with now that obviously we haven't ever had to really deal with before.
Speaker 2:So but I'm encouraged by what I see. Definitely it makes me happy to see these companies, you know, cause I think they're setting standards now. They're they're multi-billion dollar companies, you know. Smaller companies cannot necessarily afford that, but I think it. It hopefully will percolate down and it will become less expensive. But and I think what's also great is, you're seeing a lot of online platforms that will offer some, you know, well-being and coaching and so forth. So, yeah, I'm encouraged. I am Today. I am Sometimes I'm like, oh, but again, you know when I can do this, these sort of practices, like you just get back to a state of kind of it's not just equanimity but it's an open heartedness where it's like you know, where it doesn't have to, it's okay that it it. It may be changing slowly, because you know that's the most permanent changes. It's like when you do it step by step and you can be like it's gonna, it's that, it's gonna be okay, you know yes yeah, yeah, yes hopefully make.
Speaker 1:Probably the internet has something to do with that as well, because we're so much more exposed to like people who are successful online, you know, and it's like these. I grew to this, you know this big company within this amount of time, and we're seeing all of that, we're being fed that, and so we can kind of feel like we need to do everything needs to happen now, um. So, yeah, it can feel a little bit disheartening when you might have a I don't know like I'm just using this as an example a group of you know 20 people that are coming to a class, um, and one person starts to integrate something new into their lifestyle. You're like, what do you mean? Like, but, but those are the steps we kind of need, aren't they? It's like, if you're making any positive impact, however small it might seem at first, it's got the potential to increase and grow.
Speaker 1:Yeah, agreed, more on an individual level, like when you're coaching someone, compared to like a corporation taking a bit of a, you know, representing wellness within their organization, that kind of the attitude of the CEO or of the entrepreneur or like, is it it? Do you get the? Do you get the feeling like there's, there's more of a, a conscious leadership movement happening. Do you know what I mean? Rather than rather than someone who's busy and stressed thinking, oh well, I better do it, because I'm busy and stressed and I need to improve my health, which is where I've come from. As a personal trainer, we have often had people in the past you know that that their doctor told them they got high blood pressure or whatever they got to start exercising, but they don't necessarily really desire to do it, so they kind of come because they have to. Yeah, do you get the difference? Do you? Do you see that there's a change in that kind of mentality as well, or not? That was a kind of a bit of a long convoluted.
Speaker 1:No, no, it's a great question.
Speaker 2:Yeah, no, I think you're absolutely right and you can probably speak to this. So I coach professionals I don't specialize in CEOs, okay and just and also some stressed out moms who were like I thought it'd be so much easier to to not have to work. But, you know, because our society and the pressure we put on ourselves like we want to work, we want to be contributing, and that and that's part of what it is to be human, you know, because that contribution, you know, cause that contribution. But they the big stress I see for moms is that they don't. They cause. You know, being a mom is in and of itself not a hugely validating job, you know, especially when they're teenagers. You know, and I speak from experience, they're just like you know, it's not, it is a, you know, and it should be like it's one directional you give to them and later, hopefully, you get back in the form of a well-adjusted human, you know, who you know can care for themselves and so forth and so forth.
Speaker 2:But I was reading on CEO leadership because I am interested in the leadership space and the executive space. A lot of them just want and you've probably seen this like a lot of them just want to be told what to do. They just, okay, I know I need to do this. So, you know, and that's a little different than sort of a coach. A coach is, you know, trying to. Now in, I think, in physical training that's different as, OK, you're there and and really the the art of it is, you've got to figure out a way to tell them what to do. So, but not to where it's so much that they just start pushing back. Or, if they do, you help them overcome that. Right, in coaching, you're trying to help them find the answers, you know it's it's a different kind of partnership. So I love that question so much because, you know, I've found some people really just do want to be told what to do, um, and so my job is just to let them realize that that's what's happening.
Speaker 2:You know, like hey, um, you know it may be that you're so used to it, but the the long term answers and changes you want to make aren't necessarily going to be told, going to be ones that someone tells you what to do. It again has to come from the inside. So then, like and you've probably seen that like people who are forced to take up exercise. If they don't find one that they like, eventually they'll abandon it. You know like it has to. You know it has to be part of of who they are. Or you know if, if you know it has to be part of of, um, who they are. Or you know if, if, if they're just super committed to getting healthy, then you know that can that can be overcome. But, um, so I do my best not you know to to to stay out of telling people what to do.
Speaker 2:But there's a lot of crossover. You know, um and uh, some people want to be told that and I have to redirect and be like, well, let's, let's explore this differently. You know differently because it's ultimately cause I think the way the human ego and the mind is set up is that, um, it has to be finessed a little bit. You know, because for a while you'll be like, okay, I like being told what to do and there are some benefits. If going in the contract is that like with a personal trainer and even with a coach, like some executives, just be like, okay, I want you to come and drill me and, you know, be super hard on me. That's not necessarily my approach in coaching, but I have seen it be effective. But I think with this finessing, like because eventually I think there'll be maybe some resentment over being told what to do and then there'll be the inevitable pushback. So yeah, I don don't know. I hope that answered, I think so.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think I touched on it in there somewhere yeah, it's um, I I find that well, definitely with physical, you know, physical coaching, someone training them, you, if they do, just like being told what to do, because I've got some clients who are just like I don't remember do, because I've got some clients who are just like I don't remember what I did last week, compared to some that are completely like, yeah, this is what we did and I can't remember, but like finding the ways for them to feel like they're the one to start making the decisions for themselves. Right Answering questions what did you do last week? How did it feel Like, where do you want to go with? This kind of thing? I think that can happen, probably in what you do and in the exercise world.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, totally so. But the I mean, I definitely think when you get to CEO, you know executive levels they do have to execute, no matter how they're feeling. A friend who, several friends who have mbas, and she's like a vp in tech and she, uh, in business school she was like, well, yeah, you're just, you know, you're just trained to be effective, to make you know, I think that that it's training in there to make decisions no matter how you're feeling. But you know, uh, long term, I think you can do that long-term, but there's a compartmentalization that has to happen.
Speaker 1:Yeah, totally yeah. That's a bit of a trade-off, isn't there? Mm-hmm, all right, I feel like we're getting close to that special topic.
Speaker 2:Oh, getting the big finish.
Speaker 1:So we're not finished yet. No, I want to make sure we've got enough time for this special topic. Um, um. So you, you bring, you've brought your through through your own personal studies and through what you've been doing for the last 20 years as a yoga teacher and a meditation teacher. You've kind of brought these things together to create tools to support your clients in those kind of high performing roles so that they can get more fulfillment right, so that they can actually tap into their full potential in those roles. Because, like you said, there can be that mentality of it being like this is how I do it and they're trained to do it and it's all very in the head, go for it, mental, but at the end of the day, like we said, there's a trade-off. But, but at the end of the day, like we said, there's a trade-off.
Speaker 1:We hear stories also of people who feel, uh, unhappy, even though to you know the external person, it might seem that they were very successful. You know, they've got the money, they've got the job, they've got all of the things, feel unfulfilled, and so you've kind of created this coaching, I imagine, to kind of help to support people in their health, because, you know, people die from stress. Let's face it, even though it's not really very well acknowledged, it's like a big one Using your yoga meditation and drum roll. Well, the ventral branch vagus nerve um activation toning.
Speaker 2:Yeah, um, there's like there's a lot of uh, um terms of art out there for it. Um, I guess you know activation kind of is a misnomer. I like toning, but people are like, what do you mean toning? But it's also, if you think about muscle toning, you know you're building the ventral branch of the vagus nerve. So I think toning I like a little better because people are in stress, they don't want to activate. You know you don't need to activate or stimulate, you need to regulate, which is to help it come to to a more equal, equalized state of um. And what I mean between that is you know, there's just an overview the autonomic nervous system, um, and then there's the sympathetic state, which is I mean we could go down a rabbit hole on this, but I think it's safe to say it's it's fight, flight or freeze. You know it's that stress state, um and people.
Speaker 1:Some people are so used to it right, that they don't sorry to interrupt you, that they don't know that when they're not in that state they don't know what to do themselves. They almost feel more exhausted when they're rest, like like yeah, resting makes them agitated because they're so used to that adrenaline cortisol to get them going.
Speaker 2:Yeah, totally Totally. I, that's no, no, no, it's, it's spot on. And I, um, when you said adrenaline and cortisol, I got excited because what you know I've noticed with people, some people have more of um, a cortisol response. Um, some people have more of a cortisol response and some people have more of an adrenaline response. The cortisol is the, it's the when you know you're going to be under like long. You know it's kind of like it long term stress, the higher cortisol levels. A lot of times, you see, like the chronic ones or the people who are under kind of chronic stress for whatever reason, you know that's not necessarily just their jobs, it's, you know, maybe they have a food allergy or something you know something like that, whereas adrenaline one that's kind of you know, because that's linked to dopamine.
Speaker 2:So much that feeling, yeah, in the brain. So so that I'm sorry I just wonked on that which is totally off topic, but I guess not really.
Speaker 1:Yeah, no, I think that's really a really good, a really interesting uh way to differentiate them, actually, because I just always throw them in together. But yeah, that's yeah, I think.
Speaker 2:I think I tend to have more adrenaline responses like I can, when under stress I can be like I can be, oh, I can be kind of you know kind of yeah, and I think that is an adrenaline response um more of an adrenaline response than a cortisol. Like a cortisol, I don't think they get as flinchy um but it's just long low grade stress yeah yeah and it could be lack of sleep and, yeah, poor diet.
Speaker 1:Not exercising, like, as you said, allergies, like, yeah, environmental stuff yeah, yeah, okay.
Speaker 2:Yeah, we're under. We're under a lot of of. You know, we definitely have a lot of things that that can contribute to that, but, um, you know.
Speaker 1:So back to sympathetic, yeah, okay I was just going to say, could you kind of talk us through the ventral nerve, the vagus nerve, sorry, the vagus nerve, um, and we, I know you've talked about the sympathetic and the parasympathetic, but like what, um, what is the vagus nerve like? Where does it come from, where does it go to? What does it?
Speaker 2:run, yeah, it runs through it all. So it's cranial nerve 10 and it's at the starts, at the base of the brain, um, and it the latin translation for vegas is wandering and they call it that because it's one of the longest, if not the longest nerve, is cranial nerve in the body, you know ones the lungs and the heart and down in through the viscera, so the intestines. So you know it's, it's long and so the body, informed resiliency work. The technique I created it involves a lot of self massage that you, you know, you massage those nerves and it helps, you know, can work backwards.
Speaker 2:And just the you know, massage in and of itself, and the hands are extension of the heart energy, sort of that healing energy. Okay, yeah, yeah, Doing that, it has the effect of relaxing you there. But the underlying science of it is that it's actually toning that ventral branch, and the vagus nerve has two branches. The ventral is the front and then there's the dorsal, which is the back. Um, apparently the dorsal, it gets more activated or toned, I don't know if it's yeah, maybe tone, let's say activated, um in in more of sympathetic work. So, or it may just be a default, like that's the one that is more active, and so we have to consciously tone this ventral branch of the vagus nerve and high ventral vagus nerve. High tone is like high muscle tone. Right, it's a good thing, you know. It means that you've been, you know working it, but I guess I would say working with it. You know, because again, work is in our society. It's like, oh, effort, effort, whereas I mean there's a little bit of effort, but it actually feels relaxing, like you're not over-efforting.
Speaker 1:How do we know if it's not toned? I feel like I've heard someone who was a gut specialist talking about how you can tell if it's working well or not based on whether you have a gag reflex. Is that a thing? Maybe that's to do with a digestive?
Speaker 2:a thing. Um, maybe that's to do with a digestive. Yeah, I, I wouldn't be surprised if, if that is the case, um, um, so through the, the research. So, uh, back to yoga, real quick. Um, what I was just seeing, and I think what really made me and vegas nerveral branch we were going to be besties is, um the yoga I was trained in, we would do an invocation, a chanting invocation class.
Speaker 2:Every time I would do that, I would start yawning and my eyes would start watering, um, and I would look around and they were like it wasn't really happening to other people. And I would look around and they were like it wasn't really happening to other people. And I talked to my teacher and they're like no, that doesn't really. But OK, you know, it's probably. I just thought, ok, maybe there's something about it. And this is true, that it was oxygenating my brain. You know so. You know when you, at least for me, when I start oxygenating, I will start yawning. At least for me, when I start oxygenating, I will start yawning. And um years later, there's a um, an expert on this work, um Stanley Rosenberg, and he's written a book, um about the vagus nerve and um, so, sighing, yawning and um, swallowing, all mean that um, when you're in the context of this work, and I think in general too, it means that your ventral branch is coming online. Because if you think about it like, you can't really yawn when you're in fight or flight, you're just, you're just like focused, you're just like focused Um and uh, you know. Same for sighing and swallowing. So anytime that those are experienced, I I think it's a good indication. It certainly is for me that you're starting to tone that vagal, uh, that vagal nerve in terms of knowing when it's not toned.
Speaker 2:I would think the gag reflex is probably a good um, a good clue, because um, uh, I think a lot of that comes from, uh, if your gut is tight, you know you can't, you know it could, could, um, lead to like feeling nauseous and gagging easily. Another like gag reflex. I guess, if you smell something bad, that can cause the gag reflex. So I don't know, I haven't looked at the gag reflex. I mean I would say in general people could do more to surrender to this work and tone that branch, I mean cause it. I feel like it's both cumulative, in that you know, over time it helps you deal with stress responses better, but then it's also. You can do it, um, even if you haven't done it before, and get results from it. You know where you just feel like and I always tell people it's like, it's not again. It's the small steps, like if you feel five or 10% better, you feel five or 10% better.
Speaker 1:You know Well, it's going to make you want to do it again, right, if you feel better, hopefully. So you've developed this particular um toning practice and it's is it like? Is it like just holding in those particular areas? Is there massage? Is there chanting as well?
Speaker 2:yeah, well, so body informed resiliency does not include chanting. What I found with chanting? So, chanting usually scares people cause they're like great, I'm going to have to light incense and sit cross-legged for a year, right, um, um. But one of the fastest ways to to um, activate the or to tone the nerve is to, you know, you can make sounds, and this happens like people feel better when they start singing their favorite song, right, yeah, I mean that is the power of both music, because music is like otherworldly, but they're actually participating and that is giving it that like yay, double boost there.
Speaker 2:But chanting Aum, especially because Aum is like a primordial, just, it's supposed to. You know how I look at it is, it's kind of like the back beat of the universe, like you're tapping into something greater. But if you're, if that's too woo, just giving it a try, practically speaking, you're just gonna feel better, you know. So, um, that's a um, and and I've even had clients where I'm like it's gonna sound a little crazy, you, because a lot of people it's like vocalizing, especially women, like using the voice, right, um, just, uh, vocalizing it is a bit scary for them, but I was like, okay, if you can't do that, then start by just um, doing it silently, and see what it does and and um, I've had good results and I've had clients have good results with that. But so I do have a chanting course, but body form resiliency, I would say the foundations of that, the big one is diaphragmatic breathing, because and you probably know this well, but most people don't we don't know how to.
Speaker 2:Really the thing about breathing with the diaphragm is what it does, is it causes a flare. The ribs flare, right, and you just are able to bring, and it takes a little bit of work and especially if you're stressed, because the muscles in the ribs are intercostal muscles, right, and they're going to be. If you're stressed, then they're, you know, tight. So if you bring um, if it once you warm up and you just get more oxygen into your lungs, so and then that's it's super empowering, um, and because the vagus nerve, um, you know it provides some, some nerves to that area by um, you know, really consciously breathing like that, you're stimulating those nerves, which is working kind of backwards to um, tone the ventral branch.
Speaker 2:So, um, foundationally it is um, it's a huge piece and people just feel better, even if they're resistant to it, because a lot of times meditation, the thought of meditating is is very scary to people, but most anyone will be like, okay, you're teaching me the mechanics of breathing, like I can, you know it's practical, you know I can, I can do that and so forth, and and they can really feel like it's empowering to feel your lungs open like you're like, because most of us aren't. We don't breathe, you know.
Speaker 1:We nipple up to clavicle, you know which is all that kind of stress, kind of that's sort of sending the message, isn't it to the, to the rest of your system, that you're in fight or flight? It's like that short, quick, yeah, yeah, totally um, and yeah, it is.
Speaker 2:it is a and, and there's a reason. It's fine for us to do that, you know, because it does promote a kind of an alert state which we need to get through most of the conscious things that you know we're doing during the day. That's fine. It's just again, what's the trade-off? And how do you balance and so to really feel a sense of your, really, the reconnecting with kind of your purpose and your being? I think diaphragmatic breathing is a crucial first step. So that's huge, and then I do I also.
Speaker 2:Another big piece is elongating the side bodies, because we sit all day. They, you know, they crunch down and then of course, we don't, we don't feel very empowered, you know, like we're not, you know. So opening up those and moving cerebral spinal fluid and then and then really the self massage. I think is one of the most favorite pieces. There's hand massage and throat massage and the facial massage, scalp massage, and it sounds kind of weird. You're like, well, why don't I just go to a masseuse? But in cases where you're like I'm feeling really stressed out, it's super empowering to know I have this practice. I can do it on my own, you know, I just need five minutes, you know, alone and even just to breathe or do seated cat cows, you know, and stretching the side bodies.
Speaker 2:And then there's also eye work. And then there's also eye work. So because the vagus branch, the vagus nerve excuse me, the ventral branch, the nerve in, you know, it's a kind of a big nerve then it shoots off other nerves in its right, near the optic nerve. So when you move your eyeballs in a certain way, it it, it also tones there. And again, for me, how I know it's working is I still get the eye watering, I still get, I still yawn and then swallow and sigh. And you know, like sigh, sigh is like, when you sigh you're like, ah, like that's a contented thing, right, like that's a release and a surrender thing it's.
Speaker 1:you know it's so, intuitively, it makes sense Hmm, when, uh, when people come to, when people come to you for coaching, is it because they have acknowledged that they are stressed, they need help? Is it curiosity? Um, what's going on for for your clients?
Speaker 2:um, well, it's usually that stress is is getting in the way of of them reaching a goal, like they'll, you know they'll. They'll be like I go to do something and it's, you know it's either work or it's a personal goal. Um, and I'm just too tired, or my mind is blank, or I sit down to do it and I can't do it, um it down to do it and I can't do it. So those are obstacles. But what they suspect is, you know that their stress level is also, you know. So it's a goal, but it's also maybe one of the goals is just to enjoy life more, or, you know, be more present. You know it's. It usually does have like a. They are looking for a more. You know they've tried other things or they've, they're doing quite well, but they, they can't get to the next level and it's because they're perceiving or feeling a lot of stress in their bodies. So it's too. And then there's other like, so I get them in, maybe, or I do get them in a lot like with okay, here is this work, this will help with the relaxation. It's not a huge commitment, it can be done. You know, five or 10 minutes, and we can, you know. Look at. You know their productivity and accountability and you know there's definitely hacks there. You know there's journaling to do and you know I have a whole process there and that's I'm working on content for creating a new course on that piece.
Speaker 2:You know, kind of the productivity piece, yeah, of course you know just to to. You know there, and, and a lot of the productivity has to do with energy management, because so much of life is managing energy. Right. So, and not beating up on yourself when, like you know, like you were saying, there can be a lot of things at play, like bad sleep or you know, if you have a food allergy, you know, and not necessarily making excuses with those, but realizing they could be at play. So, especially like if you didn't sleep well or you've had a rough week with a lot of deadlines, like you need to be in maintenance mode. You're not going to be in conquer the world mode, you know what I mean. You're not going to be uber productive in terms of like it's so easy, you know. So the maintenance mode you drop down to and then there's, you know ways to just keep moving, I think of just keep swimming and finding Nemo, but yeah, so maintenance modes, it's hugely important.
Speaker 1:Yeah, right, yeah, that's really, that's like. It's so simple, isn't it Like? When we can't always be like full on going for gold, like a lot of it is just that slow, steady, stable, consistent maintenance so that when we are ready we've got the backup yeah yeah it's a huge part of life what kind of results um do your do you see in your clients?
Speaker 1:like, what do you see these massive shifts in in not only their physicality, their stress levels, their productivity, but like it just in. Do you see some shifts in their like perspective on what's important, anything like that, going on?
Speaker 2:yeah, I mean definitely, I think you know, with coaching. So my minimum is three months, um, and then I have your long programs as well, um, in terms of one-on-one coaching, and you know, usually what happens is they'll buy a course first and they'll like that and then reach out for that. So, um, yeah, I mean, I, I do that. There is there, have been there always. It's always, or not always.
Speaker 2:Most of the time it's quite subtle in that they just get downloads and awarenesses and perspectives in terms of their ability to relax and be in the moment. You know that with the maintenance mode they just feel like, oh, I really am productive, like they reconnect to this knowledge of, and this knowing of, how much we actually really do every day. They don't dismiss that and then that builds confidence so that they can. You know they keep moving in that direction and towards a goal and you know if you're moving, taking step by step, you know it's that, um, the plane analogy like you, you point, your your the nose of the plane to where you want to go. Eventually you're going to get there. You know, like, maybe you have to slow down, maybe there's turbulence, but you will get there. So I, I had a.
Speaker 2:I've had a, a client who really wanted to write a book and she has written a book. It's a small book, but you know she's been putting that off for years. It was a YA book and so to see her be like you know I can't believe. I mean I've been putting this off for years and every time I would sit down you know it'd be my background's also in writing, professional writing, and so that was a neat. That's probably been my one of my favorites because it kind of like it's an intersection of of many of my skills. So, um, but yeah, she, she wrote that book, so that's pretty great.
Speaker 1:We've um, cracked, uh, cracked the hour and I'm conscious of our, of your time, but I would like to um ask you you, I'm going to try and make this kind of like a simple question, but I don't know, I can't make any promises, just see how it comes out.
Speaker 1:So I'm just thinking about, like I've been exploring this kind of intersection of spirituality and health and where they come together, and I'm kind of sort of feeling more like there's these we're able to link back to, like you know, ancient techniques and practices and bring them into the 21st century working life and use them to support our health, Like, for example, meditation for the stressed executive. And I've just been exploring, like what are the connections between this sort of ancient wisdom, the spirituality, and modern day life and health? So I would love to hear if you have any insights on that, because I feel like you've kind of touched on the bigger picture, people's purpose, but also you're working in that space of people's health, in this 3d, in this three-dimensional reality, um, so, yeah, I just wondered if you had any insights or inklings around that. Yeah, not, not a very simple question.
Speaker 2:I love this question, so if I start going way off, you just be like come on, let's rein it back in um because, this touched, just touches on a little bit of cosmology, right, like how the cosmos was designed, gets reduced down often to a lot of sexual practices. But actually Tantra itself, like one of the, the the translation is tools for liberation. And and the Tantrikas, back in Kashmiri Shaivism which I forget when the time was, but you know they had a lot of time this sort of priestly class let's call it that or caste, you know, they devoted themselves to liberation, much like you would see, maybe clergy living, you know, maybe the nunhood or the priesthood, you know, and so they devoted a whole lot of time to these practices and they're very rigorous practices. Um, if you, you know, if you want to go that route, there is definitely that Um, but it also had a part of it where it could help. Um, tools, uh, for householders, you know, um, but it has a beautiful cosmology about, like, you know who we are in in the, the scheme of things, and particularly this, the, the Shakti set, and Shakti is sort of the, the divine feminine, but feminine as creative power.
Speaker 2:A lot of times in the West the feminine is like where it's more receptive, you know, the receiving and the nurturing. It's actually everything in this tantric philosophy, but it is power, so it creates us and then dwells within us and lives within us and all our creativity comes from that and it's actually the masculine, which is the Shaivic or Shiva. That is stillness, that is the emptiness, and we have both energies in us. They're outside of us and they're in us, in us. They're outside of us and then they're both in there in us, you know. So when we talk about the ancient technologies, I kind of come from, or ancient practices, I come from that perspective. So that's why, like all you know, all this movement you know, which is daily life, is divine, right, you know it's not. Even our stress levels are divine. Um, our body is divine. It's. It's amazing, our body responds that way, because in truly dangerous situations that's when people come in and say I just knew what to do, like, you know, also divine mean, that's just amazing.
Speaker 2:You know, the chronic part of it, not great, but all of this, the interest and the concern to address that, you know, divinely creative. So, you know, I just think it's wonderful we have that and we've got all this motion going. And then we need stillness. There have to be both um and we have the capacity for both um in us. So that helps me. When sometimes I'm I, I can still definitely get into like, like pushing myself, um, because that is important, that is, you know, effort is important. It's the be do have right, you need, you need both, um, that doingness, but um, you also have to be the being um and so um, yeah, I, I think they're both, they're both sacred, they're both divine, um, so, yeah, they're super important.
Speaker 1:I hope that answered your question well, I'm thinking of then and it's something that I'm becoming more aware of in more recent times is like that, that sense of thinking about all the things you've got to do and like being in that you know you can be in that kind of anxious, stressed, like overwhelmed, know, depending on where you're at. And then it's that bringing it back to hang on a minute. Let's come back to the heart. What's my heart doing? What does my heart say? Like just that simple kind of like drawing your attention back inside and and that reminder it's all right, all is well, like, yeah, the external reality is just kind of like one thing yeah, I like that too, because, um, you know, circumstances outside of you will change.
Speaker 2:You know my dogs are getting excited about this. Um, you know, and really all you have is is really what's inside of you, because you can lose whatever's outside of you, um, and then recreate it, because that's our nature is to is to be divinely creative. And so, um, and even if you know even people who feel like they're off the path or who've maybe made wrong decisions, you know they, they were still, you know that is still a divine act because it's it's creativity right, um, you know they they're optimal divine acts. And then some that are, you know, less sustainable, less supportive of of, you know, or life affirming. But, yeah, I, I think you're absolutely right. Like the, the stillness helps you get into your heart. You know, um, some people.
Speaker 2:What I was noticing is that, for a lot of people in the West were trained in the doing very well, we're very good at that. We've built amazing civilizations based on that. Um, not, and not just the West, I mean certainly in the in the East and Southeast Asia. They've done that as well, but, um, you know, we've definitely, I think we're good at doing um, and the being just needs to to be stressed a little bit as well, and I, I think we're we're seeing that, you know, and I think that's super, super, duper important yeah sorry, okay, oh look at you, how cute she's a troublemaker, so I'm gonna sit her up here, sorry, absolutely love a dog yes, I know um.
Speaker 2:Thank you so much.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think that was yeah, it was a really beautiful way to end the conversation. I've really appreciated your time. We've got your details in your profile in our guest directory so we can direct everyone there.
Speaker 2:There's links to your website, to your socials. Is there anything in particular you would like to?
Speaker 2:like lead the pop up and for their email I will send them. It's a 20 minute guided at this level. You know, again, it's for me I work in five and 10% because I feel like that's a good building block. You know, if I I don't love it when people you're going to feel a hundred percent better, you know like. You know, if you feel five or 10% better you're going to feel you know it's powerful percent better you're going to feel. You know it's powerful and usually people feel a lot better and so if you're feeling down here, it can get you to the next level and if you're, if you're feeling great, it can get you to the next level.
Speaker 2:So, and I think, just to be in a healing environment, you just get downloads, you get your next idea, you get a reconnection to who you really are, you get a connection to it's. You're going to be okay, everything is going to be okay. It's okay to take these moments of stillness in this divine chaos. You know of your, you know for yourself, and yeah, um, yeah, I've, I've had a lot of good results, so, and then they'll go on, you know they'll go on the mailing list and then I will um, you know, send them goodies as well. Cool.
Speaker 1:Sounds great, brilliant, all right. Well, we're going to make sure that we uh get all of those that info in the show notes, so you'll be able to um get the link for the website and hopefully people will connect with you. I've loved our conversation. Sorry, I lost my thread a couple of times when I had like these questions that came in and then I was listening and I was like it's gone yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think that's just like the nature of the like. Space is created, like we created this, like healing space, and it opens things up and then then things kind of, you know, turn that way. But I always think that's a good indication that it's a good conversation. You know one that's yeah good, great.
Speaker 1:Thank you so much. It's been wonderful meeting you.
Speaker 1:I really appreciate your time same same, thank you before you go, can I ask you a small favor. If you've enjoyed this show or any of the other episodes that you've listened to, then I'd really appreciate it if you took a couple of moments to hit subscribe. This is a great way to increase our listeners and get the word out there about all of the wonderful guests that we've had on the podcast. If you'd like to further support the show, you can buy me a coffee by going to buymeacoffeecom. Forward slash, life, health, the universe. You can find that link in the show notes. Thanks for listening.