Life, Health & The Universe
Welcome to **Life, Health & The Universe**, the podcast dedicated to empowering women in their 40s and 50s to embrace a vibrant and meaningful life. Join us as we explore the intersection of health, wellness, and personal growth, offering insights and inspiration to help you navigate this transformative stage of life.
Each week, we dive into topics that matter most to you— from holistic health and nutrition to mindfulness and self-discovery. With expert interviews, relatable stories, and practical tips, we aim to inspire you to live your best life, cultivate deeper connections, and find purpose in every moment.
Whether you’re seeking to enhance your well-being, explore new passions, or simply find a supportive community, **Life, Health & The Universe** is here to guide you on your journey. Tune in and discover how to thrive in this exciting chapter of life!
Contact Nadine: https://lifehealththeuniverse.podcastpage.io/contact
Life, Health & The Universe
Emergent Human Design: Navigating Your Cosmic Blueprint - Founder of Love Your Design, Kim Gould
Kim Gould, mentor and coach with over two decades of experience in Human Design, takes us on a journey through her evolution from litigation lawyer to founder of the Love Your Design community. In this profound conversation, we explore how Human Design has transformed from a rigid system to a dynamic framework that empowers people to understand their unique energetic blueprints.
The brilliance of Human Design lies in its synthesis of multiple wisdom traditions—Hindu chakras, Kabbalistic mysticism, Western astrology, and Chinese philosophy—creating something far greater than the sum of its parts. Kim shares how this integrated approach helps us become "someone we recognise but couldn't have imagined we could be," providing practical tools for authentic living in turbulent times.
What makes this episode particularly timely is Kim's perspective on Human Design's role in our current global transformation. As traditional power structures shift toward more distributed networks, she explains how alignment with our authentic design naturally guides collective consciousness toward integration and higher awareness. This emergent approach to leadership—where each person recognises when to step forward or step back based on their unique design—offers a refreshing alternative to hierarchical models built on charisma or authority.
We also dive deep into the relationship between fear and control in society. Kim suggests that patriarchal and capitalist systems operate through manufactured vulnerability, keeping us dependent on authority figures. Human Design offers a pathway beyond these patterns by reconnecting us with our innate wisdom and authentic responses.
Whether you're new to Human Design or already exploring your chart, you'll find Kim's approach refreshingly practical and accessible. Her advice centres on trust—trusting the present moment and using that awareness to make empowered choices. Through her Love Your Design community, she continues to make Human Design education available to anyone seeking to understand their unique role in this period of great awakening.
Ready to discover how your design fits into the emerging future? This conversation might just be your perfect starting point.
You can find Kim's full profile in our Guest Directory
https://lifehealththeuniverse.podcastpage.io/person/kim-gould
Welcome to Life, health and the Universe, bringing you stories that connect us, preventative and holistic health practices to empower us and esoteric wisdom to enlighten us. We invite you to visit our website, where you can access the podcast, watch on YouTube and find all of our guests in the guest directory. Visit lifehealththeuniversepodcastpageio. Now let's get stuck into this week's episode. If you've been listening to Life, health and the Universe for a while, you've probably heard me talking about human design.
Speaker 1:Today's guest, kim Gould, has been my guide in human design for the past 18 months and I'm part of her Love your Design community. Kim is a mentor and coach of human design with over 20 years of experience and the founder of Love your Design, which includes education and community for seekers of the human design system. That's a very loose description of what Love your Design does, kim, but I kind of wanted to. You know I needed to do something simple, so thank you so much for joining us. I'm really looking forward to having you here. It feels like a great honor to have you all to myself we're usually in a group.
Speaker 2:Yes, because we're usually in the group, but same lovely to get to hang out with you. And um, yeah, even though we we could probably get together at coffee and have coffee sometimes because we live down the road, it's so busy we never get around to that.
Speaker 1:I'm going to the conference again this year, so we'll get to get to hang out there. So human design it's been a massive part of your life for the last 20 years so many people. I'm really amazed that so many people still haven't heard about it and you probably still get that right. Can you tell us a little bit just about how you found it and how it's kind of evolved for you over?
Speaker 2:the last 20 years and sure so so just to go back a little bit further, you know I was a lawyer before yeah, right, um, and and I was a litigation lawyer. So you know I really loved being in court and your honour, your honour, I really, I really actually enjoyed the drama but also the intellectual challenge. That was fun. But then, you know, I got really, really sick and as I started to get better I was, I was going and looking for what I wanted to do. That felt more aligned and I trained in a whole lot of things. I can't even remember half of them now, but I know I did train in kinesiology. There were a whole lot of things that I did. I went and did all these courses and I was kind of checking everything out and I kept getting all excited this is this, is it, this is it.
Speaker 2:And then I was, um, writing for a magazine which was about indigo children back in the day, when that was really huge and I and it was a US-based magazine and they sent me a magazine in the mail because it was kind of almost pre-internet back then, in very early days of the internet, and I opened the magazine and there was a human design mandala in it and for all of this like an ad. It was an ad. All of this. Um, oh, I'll try that, oh, I'll try that or try that. I saw that mandala and I went there. It is uh-huh, there it is. That's, that's the thing. I just it was like no question, that was the thing. So, but there was, it was like no question, that was the thing. So. But there was no training. There was no, like there was nothing that I could do.
Speaker 2:And also I was living for oh well, a lot of your people are Australian, I suppose out the back of Byron Bay, like really almost to Kyogle, in the middle of absolutely nowhere, you know, single, single mom, two little kids. Well, it was. It was difficult to even think about where, how I would get any training. But that's when I made my connection with Zeno Dixon, who was a friend and mentor to me for many, many years until she passed um, and so we used to talk on the phone and you know, I did her training course and we used to save up, you know, because it was expensive to call on the phone, because she was in New Mexico. Anyway, that was, that was kind of how I started. But I I remember when the first bundle of her material came. I literally did not leave my house for months, like I think I was there, for it was about three months before I even wanted to leave the house. The only reason I left the house was to.
Speaker 2:I didn't leave the house much anyway because we were out this you know paradise that we lived in. But um, the only reason I really left the house was to go and buy the Wilhelm I Ching. Um, the only I Ching you could buy back then, because there was nothing on the gates.
Speaker 1:Oh right.
Speaker 2:I know it's hard for people now to actually kind of think about what the environment was like back then. There was nothing anyway. So, yeah, anyway. So I, you know, I worked with Zeno and I just had to follow my instincts, really and trust that they led me in the right direction. And then, of course, I started writing, and that's when writing became such a huge thing for me. So I started my blog actually in 2002 and writing became a real way for me to tease out out what I knew.
Speaker 1:Okay yeah, yeah, because if you only had um access to well, to the the, what was the guy? The I Ching? I think I've got that book as well that's the first one I bought.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, did you find?
Speaker 1:that you were interpreting a lot of the stuff yourself, or was it from you, from Zeno, your mentor, like she'd say? This means that you know this gate in.
Speaker 2:She didn't do that that's not how she taught. She was very, um, she was very structural in the sense that, um, you know, she would look at this, she looked very much at the structure of the chart, wasn't an interpretative person. She would say to me, well, this is in relation to that and, and I would say, but what does it mean? What does it mean? I used to say that all the time. What does it actually mean? That's my line one, right, I want to make it practical. Well, if I'm going to use this gay energy with someone, what does it mean for them? How are they feeling it? So, yeah, that was really my.
Speaker 2:That was where I was always always kind of digging into the, the practical applications for things. And even, you know, back then some, you know, I always use Hilary Barrett's I Ching because it's, you know, it's quite poetic but also quite practical in a way. And it was the first time that I read an I Ching and thought, oh, this just makes so much sense because you kind of a lot of the earlier ones were very much. You had to kind of trawl through and try and figure out what they meant Decipher yeah, it's really difficult to understand what they mean.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's all very cryptic, yeah, and very what's the word? Paternalistic as well, which I used to do a lot, a lot, yeah, I nearly walked away from human design because I thought I can't. I can't work with a system where it says you know, women should be at home and keep their mouth shut which was what my my chiron in game 37 said. I was like I don't think that's gonna happen.
Speaker 1:I love it. So over 20 years you've obviously seen it change a lot and you've developed your, would you say. You've developed your own style, would you say that's kind of what. Yeah, I think yeah it's a yeah, so you? I don't even like calling human design a system. It sounds so like it's so much more than that, isn't it?
Speaker 2:yeah, sounds so mechanical I use the word mechanics all the time which.
Speaker 1:I, yeah, don't use that word yeah, to me it's all about moving away from the mechanics of things yeah, and it's actually really quite um uplifting to know that it's like you've got the material but it's like yours, to kind of grow and develop as you experience it right, which has obviously come through the work that you've done with individuals reading their charts, working with them one-on-one and in the Love your Design membership. Yeah, so it's changed a lot for you, hasn't it?
Speaker 2:Massively, massively. But it's interesting to look at it over that timeframe, because there was this small group of heretics who we weren't affiliated. A lot of this stuff sounds crazy now, but if you weren't affiliated with Ra Uruhu's group and paying to have territory, so I wasn't paying for Australia, right?
Speaker 1:Oh, got it.
Speaker 2:The person who started after me came and paid for the Australian territory and so I was getting harassed because I was operating illegally in Australia and there was a lot of um what would the word be, the turpitude I can't even think of like a negative energy coming, and there were only a few. There were only a few people who were operating outside of those bounds back then, and now that's just like doesn't even, it's not even a thing anymore.
Speaker 1:No, it would be like trying to.
Speaker 2:If you weren't exactly repeating Ra's words like word for word, if you weren't exactly teaching, and even to do a reading, you had to do what was called foundation reading, which you had to go in a certain order through the material. So it was very strict in terms of how you were allowed to operate in the human design world back then. And if you weren't, you you really were in a not in a very pleasant position in in regard to the general community. So it's changed a lot. Yes, yeah, yeah, yeah, and and also the sorry I just want to add the way that I learned human design was normal when I learned it, but now it's really not how people think about what human design even is. So even how people generally think about what human design is is very, very different to how it was for us, even those of us outside of the kind of normal system.
Speaker 1:The normal community. Yeah, is that different in respect to like the like, that system that you were talking about, like starting at a certain point and having to go through a process?
Speaker 2:do you still know that to a degree or no, but a little bit it's. It's more than that, it's more that, um, we actually back then people tended to learn, to learn it, whereas now, which you've been through the courses in, yeah, so you know, like the way I build on the knowledge, and the whole point of that is so that you own and understand the system and you, I'm sorry, keep calling it the system now, and so you can take something like an asteroid in a gate and you have some way. You have the tools and the techniques and the and the education to be able to understand what, how that works. Or you might say, oh, I don't have that gate colored in in my chart. I wonder how that's going to affect me in my life. And you, you understand what that actually means to not have that gate. Or you can go and do the. You know the course on definition and it's all kind of laid out there for you.
Speaker 2:But what I find now is people are all about the keywords, what I call keywords. So they know what their type is, they know what their profile is, they know what you know. There's a whole lot of things that they strategy. Yeah, so, if you, if you think about having a chart and and here you've got the actual chart, and here you've got all the list of things. Most people only read the list of things and they don't read the chart, so that that list of things did not really exist when I was learning human design okay, that's all add-on stuff, okay, so even type wasn't such a big deal. It was more about learning to read the chart and people. You know, that's not so much of a thing now and so that's why that's for me, that's a legacy project for me in the community to make sure that people actually learn how to read the chart.
Speaker 1:Yeah, wow, okay, yeah, okay. Next, I'm just looking at my notes. So when I first invited you on, you've been on my wish list for quite some time and there's, interestingly, an emerging theme that's come up. I mentioned to you just before we hit record about leadership and global shifts and the need to be able to sort of sit in our, be able to sort of sit in our I don't know the word to be who we are, our authenticity.
Speaker 1:I've had the tooth fairy on the holistic tooth fairy talking about how important it is for like to be confident in our mouth so that we can speak. I've had a speech coach who talks about how we need to process our trauma so that we feel empowered to speak. There's just this theme and obviously we've got all of the shifts that are happening globally and so this is all kind of bubbling up and I feel like what you teach in the Love, your Design community and the way that you teach really speaks to all of this, and you've actually started to call your work or you may have been calling it this for a while Emergent Human Design. So can you talk a little bit about what that means?
Speaker 2:Yeah, one of the first articles that I wrote on my blog so it would have been like 2005, was about the nature of emergence, because it seemed to me at the time that the we could look at all the parts of the world, you know as they are now, and we can keep moving them around and changing how they're relating to each other, but we're not going to get anything new out of that. It's just going to be the parts in different places. So if you I I mean if you think about a jigsaw, for example, and you've got all the bits on the board, if you keep moving the bits around the board, it's still bits of a jigsaw, but if you put it into the picture, that's when you get emergence, because that's something different to all the parts of the jigsaw, right? So suddenly you've got something coherent that brings a whole new level of understanding, and for me, that's what human design is about, because think about, think about, um, how you've got. I think it's extraordinary and this is one of the things I was talking about in the community a couple of weeks ago. Why human design and why now? Which is a question that's always in the back of my mind, because in the I can't remember when it was 87, 1987, when Ra got the initial information.
Speaker 2:We've got the chakras, which is the kind of Hindu system. We've got, amazingly, the tree of life from the kabbalah, which is the jewish mysticism system. Um, we've got astrology, which is all the western mythology, so everything coming from kind of greece and rome, but that has roots back into old europe and that kind of thing. What am I missing? Um, the I Ching, the Chinese system. So to pull all of those together, put them into one picture that you can read with the level of detail and precision that you can read it with, that's like, that's mind-blowing, actually, if you just think about that, apart from anything else, that I can look at your chart and see something that draws on all of those wisdom systems. So, just in looking at the structure of the chart, there's an emergence there, because we're getting something more than the sum of its parts, which is what emergency is. And then, if we look at you as a person, basically what we're doing is we're pulling potentially for you, all of your soul threads, shall we say, from all of the, the spirituality that's existed through human history. We're pulling it all through and we're actually looking at it in you know, as we can bring it together and say this is how it all plays out now in your life in a really coherent way.
Speaker 2:So to me, it always had this potential to be incredibly emergent and to bring forth a completely new way of experiencing ourselves as human. To me, that was kind of one of the earliest things that I felt with it, what it did, and so I suppose the thing about it is for me that we are stepping into not just a new way of being ourselves like completely reef, a complete reframe. I'm really I'd really like to hear what you've got to say about that, but I feel like it makes you a different person to who you thought you were. But the person that makes it kind of helps you to become is someone that you recognize yeah, yes, yeah, yeah, yeah, it's yeah the you mean the actual, the chart the yeah and working yeah personally with yeah I was talking to someone about it the other day and, um, it's, you look at it.
Speaker 1:Well, my experience has been and when I talk to other people, this is the experience you look at it and you kind of go I know that's me, there's something you just know, yeah, but there's so much of it that I don't feel like I am yet living fully. Yeah, it's a really how do you know?
Speaker 2:how do you know that? Well, like what's the feeling of that? You can sense it, but it's not quite landed yet. Somehow.
Speaker 1:Yeah, well, I think that that's that well, the whole idea of conditioning or you know, living, you know, out of alignment with who you are, and that kind of having the courage, having the courage, almost, I think, for me to actually step into it, which is I had the girl I was talking to about it.
Speaker 1:Um, she's a manifester, and I was really curious to hear what she had to say because I, actually, when someone is living totally in alignment, like you've obviously been following your design, following living it, living your design, um, for some time there's, there's such a certainty about that it never feels wrong, like it never feels, you know, someone's saying something out of line or whatever, and for her, you know being a manifester, actually, you know realizing that she is the initiator and and that she has to make things happen, and then let go when you know, yeah, um but when we were, when we were trying to make her, um uh, an appointment to to do a call, she had to cancel a few times because it was like she was in deep in that process, that manifested process.
Speaker 1:I admired her for living it yes um, I didn't feel bad that she'd cancelled or had to reschedule or whatever, yeah. So it's kind of like yes, for me it's having the confidence and the courage to step into it. But also I'm a manifesting generator with emotional definition, so it's like I feel like, since I've learned that there's that waiting situation going on, so it's like I'm living it, but there's bits of it that I wanted you know well, you've got your will defined, so you want to push forward.
Speaker 2:We're quite similar in our chart, yeah, like, yeah, you just want to push forward and sometimes it's okay to push forward because that feels fine and you can actually do the emotional work afterwards and that feels fine. But yeah, it's yeah to balance those two yeah, definitely.
Speaker 1:And also there's that whole part of life where, like, you can't always control, control the outcome, and I think that, um, yeah, sometimes you kind of have to jump in that initiative. Yeah, the initiation um because that's where you learn the thing right, even if it's like, oh, I shouldn't do that again.
Speaker 2:Yeah yeah, I should wait next time and I think this is I think this is also this kind of myth of perfectionism. And I mean, I got really sick a couple of years ago and like literally could not. All I was doing for about two years was a tiny little bit of coaching, because I was so sick I could barely even sit up for an hour. So I would do maybe two coaching sessions a week and that was all I could manage. So this idea that you know, if you're following your design, you've got this absolutely perfect kind of life and everything, that's something that I try to not say is going to happen. But it's not to say that what happened wasn't perfect for me, because I knew that Pluto was going over my moon, saturn, and I knew it was coming and I said I've probably said this in the community I actually moved up here out of Sydney because I knew that it was going to be really big and really challenging and that I needed a quiet space for however long it was going to take, and it ended up taking about four years for me to move through that process. It was utterly, utterly life-changing and profound for me. So it's not always rosy, but I think it's always exactly what it needs to be when you can meet it.
Speaker 2:Knowing, like you said, you've got the challenge of, you've got the defined spleen, you've got the defined solar plexus, said you've got the challenge of, you've got the defined spleen, you've got the defined solar plexus centre, you've got the defined sacral. So all of those are trying to you know, and then you've got the wheel to the throat as well for you. So you're always like, yeah, go, go, go. When you've got the knowing of how to respond and what your system, how you're I'm using that word again, how but how your energy system is is, you know, engaging with the circumstances. I think that's where the incredible power is so did you when you were unwell.
Speaker 1:Um, you actually used your human design to kind of determine that that was what you needed.
Speaker 2:I knew I was going to need that, because I knew.
Speaker 1:Was it a prediction in that case?
Speaker 2:of sorts. I didn't think of it as a prediction because I've got my moon in the head centre gate, which I know when that gate's active. I need quiet, I need silence. I do not want to talk to anyone and Pluto was going to go over it. It was going to take four years for it to go over that and then over my Saturn in the next gate. I knew that when it got to Saturn that would be rebuilding, but it was Saturn, so it was going to be freaking hard work, which it was, and require a lot from me. So I knew I needed somewhere quiet. I knew I was going to need somewhere quiet and that it would be a few years.
Speaker 1:Wow.
Speaker 2:So I just felt and my relationship was ending and I knew that that really mucked me around and that I knew that that had triggered everything that was going to come up for healing in the next few years, so like it was one of the most transformational periods of my life, so I didn't see it as a prediction, I just I just knew from experience that that's what, yeah, it's going to say, it's quite amazing, isn't it, when you can go back and look at um your chart.
Speaker 1:So you work with transits and the holographic human design, so it's cool. It's a bit more of a what would you say dynamic, yeah, but when you go back and you look at big things that have happened in your life and you can actually see in your chart how that has played out. We moved up here from Sydney five and a half years ago and I've looked back over my chart for the dates that we moved and, like my chart shifted literally within like the month that we moved. We sold our business, we moved, we went to the uk for three months and we moved up here. It completely changed my holographic chart and it happened at exactly that time. Yep, it was amazing yeah, it's so.
Speaker 2:It's like almost spooky, I think, and you know, it reminds me of um, of how I've had to learn and I haven't learned this very well. I have to say that because I'm so used to everything just being so bare, like sometimes the stuff it tells you you don't, you don't want to know that, right, that can't be right me.
Speaker 2:So, um, but I have to remember, because I've become very accustomed to being open to all of that right and not everyone is, and one of the reasons I had to stop doing readings was because it was scaring people. And I didn't realise, because I'm so used to like just all this stuff being out and on the table, and I'll even, you know, talk openly in the community about stuff. But for people who aren't accustomed to that kind of conversation or who don't live with that level of openness of self, and not their fault, it's just what it is. Yeah, that's why I stepped away and just focused on the group work more and the teaching.
Speaker 1:Yeah, okay, I'm just going to shut my window because it's just like bucketing.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, it's thundering.
Speaker 1:It is so how important. Okay, let me read this phrase that I found on your website. I got lots of phrases and I was like, oh well, we can use that as a starting point. Your unique role in this great awakening. So what does that mean for you? Like when you're working with people with human design? Like it's obviously, like you said, it's come in at a really poignant point in human evolution yeah yeah, um, and people are waking up, right. So what that? That phrase, um, can you talk to that?
Speaker 2:yeah, I think it. It's interesting to think about um I. It's so important to recognize that we're driving the change through our actions. Okay, so the reason why I think human design came at the time it did and not say, you know, in the 60s, for example, um, is because a whole lot of people had to do a whole lot of self-awareness work so that we could actually engage with the human design system in a meaningful way. I don't think we could have done that back in the 60s because I think it would have been overwhelming. And then, as more and more I mean just since COVID it's just completely gone insane with the number of people who are engaging with it. Now I think I did a search Were you on the call where I did a search for what is human design and I got like 30 billion yes, like something crazy, like that. It was like an insane number of answers came up. So yeah, so it's just completely expanded.
Speaker 2:And I think for me, the thing about that is like I said that um it. It reframes who we are and helps us to be someone that we recognize, but couldn't have imagined that we could be. Oh yeah, like yeah, if I went back 20 years and look at who I am now. If I was, if I hadn't been working with human design, there's no way I would be this person. Like if I went back 20 years and look at who I am now, if I hadn't been working with human design, there's no way I would be this person. There's absolutely no chance in the world that I would be this person Really.
Speaker 2:And going back 20 years, I would not have ever thought that I would be who I am now and yet I feel so comfortable with who I am and it feels so me. So I just think the reframe that human design brings is really important. So just a good example, like with a projector you know that I think human design is so incredibly helpful for projectors because to recognise that they don't have to spend their whole life trying to be generators and that there is some value in them stepping back and actually just engaging with their own gifts. You know that's just such a massive thing in a projector's life and it's kind of the same for everyone, but in different ways, that we can suddenly find that it's kind of like something clicks in and it's like that, and now I know what it feels like when I respond in a way that's correct for me.
Speaker 2:This is my experience, anyway. It just clicks it in and then I can just go yeah, that's good, that's where I'm meant to be, and just keep you know, fine-tuning that and fine-tuning it.
Speaker 2:So you've got all of these people, more and more people who are becoming this, you know, person that they didn't expect to be. And I think that, then, is all of those people doing the things that those people are doing, that they wouldn't have done otherwise, and being the person they wouldn't have been otherwise is actually, I won't say creating the change points that we're in, but absolutely guiding it in the right direction, guiding it towards something which is, I think, a whole new level of consciousness that integrates, you know, everything we know from all the wisdom systems of the world, plus with the cosmic stuff, with all the dwarf planets and everything bringing in that you know cosmic layer, but the dwarf planets actually bring the Indigenous and the cosmic as well. So we get both of those things coming in through Pluto and the dwarf planets as well. So, you know, I think that who we are now, even in five years' time, is going to seem really limited when we look back on this time now. I think that our capacity For everyone, yes, wow.
Speaker 2:You know, one of the examples I use about that is when I started doing yoga. There were a whole lot of people who'd never heard of yoga. Yeah, like that what?
Speaker 1:And now my mum does yoga, you, everyone does yoga now yeah, well, when you think back to, you know the early 2000s or late 1990s, when computers first kind of got popular, I remember my friend telling me when I was at university that she'd sent an email to her sister in Japan and I was like what is that in? Like 1996?
Speaker 2:and you'd get you. You turn your computer and say I wonder if I've got any emails. How?
Speaker 1:but like the, the world has evolved like like 25, 30 years ago.
Speaker 2:If you'd have said.
Speaker 1:I remember we're talking as kids about. You know we used to say wouldn't it be cool if you could like see the person that you were talking to on the phone?
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah. And now you can, and now you can.
Speaker 1:So there's this whole shift of like what we're able to do.
Speaker 2:You know, I think things like, for example, the sense that so there's this whole shift of like what we're able to do. You know, I think things like, for example, the sense that the fact now that so much of our identity is embodied in the internet, that's a super big problem in lots of ways. Like you know, just in the US now they're handing over social security and tax information to who knows where. That you know where that's being handed over, but basically the entire database in the social security and tax systems is now yeah, well, yeah, you know, on the and no doubt, on the dark web. You know, I was just thinking about how Trump pardoned the Silk Road guy. I don't know if you know about that, but he was one of the biggest operators on the dark web and Trump's just pardoned him. Oh, at the time when they're also just making like hacking into the social security and tax systems. So, you know, just joining a few dots here.
Speaker 2:Anyway, I think that the idea that we're kind of captured in the internet with all of our data there, and it really is a kind of capture because it's not secure and bad actors can act on it and do things with it.
Speaker 2:So I think that kind of stuff is going to change dramatically.
Speaker 2:Anywhere where we're tending to be obedient without even realising, anywhere where we're captured, anywhere where we're passive in the face of something that goes against, I'm going to say, our individuality. But individuality for me, you know, it means that I'm myself in this amazing, you know, connection with everyone else, working for the greater good. So I think anything that prevents us from being that person is just going to fall away, and I think that identity capture on the internet is part of that. Being stuck, having to deal with email every day yeah, you know all that kind of stuff. That is almost like a farming of humanity. Our attention, you know the attention farming, what is called inshification, which is where do you know that? That's where all your apps, or, you know, your streaming services for your TV or whatever are not designed to be better for you they're actually getting worse and worse for you and you're paying more and more for them because the money's going to you, know wherever it's going and you as a consumer are really kind of just a byproduct.
Speaker 2:Yeah so all that stuff is all going to start falling away because it's going to stand in the way of us being in our individuality.
Speaker 1:Can you see that by looking at the transits in? Yeah, interestingly, I had a friend who's a futurologist. She's a food futurologist. She was on the podcast last year. Yeah, she's and she's. She basically studies global trends, yeah, um, and then looks at how they affect food. But she looks at politics, at politics and geopolitics and all sorts of things and like when there have been wars and how that's kind of shifted people's behaviors. She's fascinating. But she said don't be surprised if Trump gets in, don't be surprised if he doesn't serve a full term.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so she's actually very good at what she does, so it will be interesting to see what happens. But, it sounds like it's in line with what you're saying as well. Yeah, I'm terrible at predictions, but trends I'm very good at yeah, she says she's not, she doesn't predict, but that's what she said.
Speaker 2:So here's my bold trend prediction I think that what we'll see is a kind of decentralisation of things like food and power for our houses, for example, and a whole lot of stuff where we'll have kind of interlocked, smaller units. Okay, so I think things like food, like your community garden there in Bellingen, so community gardens, small, community-based electricity or power generation that's kind of networked.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think that kind of distributive network is going to, is going to be much more of the way that we do things for for practical stuff, you know, transport it's already, it's already kind of a thing in transport, but certainly for food and power, and and that also is, if I can just suggest, a segue, sure, to the whole leadership thing.
Speaker 2:Yes yes, Right, because I think this is also where our whole leadership you know how we unconsciously think about what leadership is is going to undergo massive change and be much more like a distributive thing network, yeah yeah, it's very hard to well, I guess it's.
Speaker 1:It can be hard to sort of visualize what leadership is when we've been, when we've been fed a a very certain type of leader, leadership which is top, you know, the top down approach kind of thing. Is that what you'd call it?
Speaker 2:like a yeah yeah, absolutely, and that you know, because I have a lot of rants about this, which you've no doubt engaged in, watching some. But the idea of the hero, you know, and that idea that one person can save us and we have to find that person, I mean that's a part of it and we all need to detox from that because that's just basically learned helplessness. So that's one thing. And then the other thing is this idea that if someone's charismatic, they're going to make a good leader, which is also not working so well for us. And that whole emergent leadership idea, which is that each one of us is a leader at a particular time and in a particular place, that we all have our leadership roles. So it's a much more subtle and flowing kind of energy where we work together, kind of as networked leaders, so we can, we know when to step up and we know when to step back yeah, yeah, and that kind of ties in with that smaller community idea, doesn't it?
Speaker 1:because you, you, you kind of well, people need to be confident and so the alignment piece, like knowing your human design and living more aligned to who you are, can help you feel more confident in those kind of situations. I'm kind of jumping around.
Speaker 2:Can I say something?
Speaker 1:Yeah, can I jump in with something? Yeah, yeah, definitely.
Speaker 2:When we have a belief that someone has to organize and control things, otherwise things are going to get out of control, and that belief is actually completely not found in nature. So if you walk into a forest, you won't find someone who's in charge of the forest. I mean, in a national park maybe, but not in like an actual, like just forest. Um, if you're watching birds bird burmation where they're flying, yeah, you won't. There's not one bird who's in charge of that. And the way that bird murmations work is that the birds have an instinct to know that they need to stay a certain amount of space away from the other bird, okay, and that they need to have a certain amount of space away from the other bird, okay, and that they need to have a certain amount of pressure.
Speaker 2:So if they're on the outside, they'll stay there for a little while, but then they'll move and someone else. So it's the pressurisation that creates the shape. But the way that they move, the way they do, is that they're keeping a certain distance from each other, and that kind of instinct. I was thinking about how humans do that too, not just in terms of don't get too close to me, but just in the way that each one of us is constantly reacting and changing our behaviour according to what the people around us are doing. And you know, look at the protests, for example, in Europe, like big, big protests in Europe in the last few weeks about authoritarianism. And people see that and then other people are like oh well, so many people are doing it, I'm going to go do it too.
Speaker 2:It's like we're constantly responding to each other's behaviours and that naturally creates kind of shapes. And you know, just like cities, that's how cities form, because people respond to each other. They go here for their bread, they go here for their coffee, they go here for their, you know. So there's this natural way of being, and I think that to actually be able to drop the belief which we've had for a long time, to be able to drop the belief that someone should be in charge.
Speaker 1:Someone should be making the rules.
Speaker 2:Yes, someone should be making the rules.
Speaker 1:And that we need to do what we're told.
Speaker 2:Yes, yeah, I was just listening to someone to on a podcast. He's a um, a geoscientist, and he was saying about, um, what was he saying? I'd forgotten what he was saying now, um, ah, no, I can't remember what I was going to say about that. Something to do with rules. I was just surprised that he that he made this comment something to do with not needing to have rules about things, because, because it's so built in all this stuff okay, so I've had this written on my piece of paper, so I reckon I'll use.
Speaker 1:I'm just gonna um see what you have to say about it. Fear how much do you feel where things are being driven by fear? What do you have to say about it?
Speaker 2:What pops up for you? I think that patriarchy and kind of, by extension, capitalism is based on intimidation and threat of violence. Okay, yeah, and, and so, um, and, and then just what you were saying also that fear that we might each one of us individually might get out of control, or that other people who are scary will get out of control. So you know, that makes us all need to out of fear, need someone to take charge and keep the order. Um, I had a horrible conversation with someone very dear to me once about how, um, after a violent upbringing, she married a violent man because she felt like he would keep her safe and it. I was gutted by that, even the idea that that she had never like it wasn't. It obviously wasn't logical because she's continued to suffer from the violence. But wow, and but I think that's us right.
Speaker 2:I think that's where we're kind of, where we all are yeah it's like we'll choose someone who's you know big and tough, because they'll save us from all the things they made us afraid of and it's better the devil you know than the devil you don't.
Speaker 1:Right. That's that kind of that idea. Fear is safe or fear is safety because you know all of the things, so what else could possibly happen?
Speaker 2:but yeah, exactly, exactly that. So, yeah, I think that um, the, the, that kind of fear, like if you go back prior to patriarchy, that fear did not exist. That fear that we live in constantly, that's like background noise we hardly even notice it now.
Speaker 1:It didn't exist and where we're heading.
Speaker 2:That doesn't look the same as back then, before patriarchy no, no, and I think this comes back to human design, right, because, um, you know, we're integrating a whole like, not just thousands of years, because I mean, patriarchy started about 5 000 years ago.
Speaker 2:We're going back way back before that. We're actually pulling all of the whole to me, the whole genome of human wisdom and spiritual understanding and what we've learned about caring for ourselves and and the planet, and what we've learned about the universe, ourselves and the planet, and what we've learned about the universe. And you know, we're pulling all of the history of that into this moment and then saying and with all of this and with the way that we live on the planet now, which is very different, where do we go from here? But if we can't access that, because we're living in the fear of, you know, constantly living with the, I mean, it kind of seems it would have seemed extreme, although I did write about this a long time ago, but it sort of seemed extreme at the time and not many people responded to it. But I think it's probably more up for people now to recognise that that's how things are, that there is a lot of manufactured fear. If we didn't have that, imagine what we could be doing.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:And if we weren't being put in a situation where we're all struggling not all struggling, but you know what I mean, like generally that kind of vibe In that. Yeah, and the vulnerability struggling, but you know, I mean like generally that kind of vibe in that, yeah, and the vulnerability of you know, am I going to be homeless or am I going to lose my social security?
Speaker 2:you know, in the us or um the price of food going up the price of food going up, but you know, am I going to be able to afford a home? Um, you know, all this stuff which should not, shouldn't be happening. And if, if that wasn't a thing, what would we be doing instead, and what kind of future could we imagine if we were free to?
Speaker 1:I think the other thing is there's this idea that if you try and imagine good things, you're being idealistic, unrealistic yeah, yeah, it's not going to happen yeah, that's never going to happen, and that's something that I think is part of this whole fear thing as well but we've actually, like there's so much evidence now to you know, with the and you you've probably read a lot more about it than I have but well, creating your own reality, the quantum field, you know, and different dimensions, the fifth dimension, and how we are actually much more in control of creating that. You know? What do you think about that? You look like you were going to say, oh, don't Look, do you know?
Speaker 2:about that? Do you look like you were going to say, oh, do you know what? I think I actually I feel like and you know, been there, done that but I also I also feel like what's super important is there's a whole lot of skills that are lacking in terms of how we relate to each other on the ground to make things happen in the real world for ourselves. And I feel like some aspects of that not all of it some aspects of that is about like la la la la don't want to see what's happening in the world. I'm going to just focus on creating lovely reality where I feel safe.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:And that world is going to get bigger and more intrusive, the more this is shying away from what's going on, and I feel like this is such an important time for everyone to be.
Speaker 2:No, I don't want to be so universal, but I think it's a really important time for people to consider that, engaging with what they want the world to actually be and and I'm not talking about everyone going out and being activists or but everyone find their own way with that. You know, for some people, it's just incredibly gentle and they're very sensitive and they just want to be, you know, sitting around crocheting and having cups of tea, and that's fine. But I think we need to be careful not to mistake shying away from what's actually happening in the world for spirituality.
Speaker 1:Okay, yeah, I don't know where that. What Fair enough.
Speaker 2:I mean, I probably do all that without realising I'm doing it now because I've done it for so long. Like if something goes wrong, I'm always like what, how, why did something go wrong? Like what done it for so long?
Speaker 1:like if something goes wrong, I'm always like what, how, why did something go?
Speaker 2:wrong, like what?
Speaker 1:because I get what you're saying about like turning your back and, just you know, creating your own nice little world and being in a bit of denial. But there's also that idea of that sense of when we step into who we truly are and how we have like we can, actually that can impact people around us.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I mean there's loads of positive things around that and I do like, I say just probably I do all that stuff without even thinking about it now. Yeah, it's just like, yeah, probably I do. But one of the things the reason I talk about you know this like la la, la la thing is because when Neptune and Saturn line up on the Aries point in February next year and they're already pretty close to lining up, it's going to be kind of a couple of years thing, but that is just really calling people to to earth in a sense. So I I think it's really important to make sure that our spiritual practices aren't a way for us to avoid yeah yeah, you know, I just think that's really important yeah, as a almost like escapism right.
Speaker 1:Yes, thank you, that's the word I'm looking for escapism.
Speaker 2:It's just, and we all do it to some degree and I just think over the next couple of years that is going to be such a big focal point for people to recognise and realise where they've been living in escapism because Neptune's gone a hundred and whatever 64 years around the cycle and it's coming around to start a new, a brand new cycle, another 164 years. So if we think about who's Neptune going to be this time around kind of thing, and it's going to be a different kind of spirituality this time around, wow, we're getting close to our hour, kim.
Speaker 1:It hasn't taken long. It's crazy. Oh, my clock says 1-1-1. Those lucky magic numbers are always popping up. I would love for you to talk about trust, I guess. Well, I just want to know what it brings up for you. Yes, straight away. It's a word that came up for me Straight away.
Speaker 2:what I'm thinking about with trust is how important it is to trust the moment. Yep, right, straight away. What I'm thinking about with trust is how important it is to trust the moment. Yeah, right, because I think a lot of what we tend to do is be hard on ourselves rather than say I'm right here now and this is exactly who I'm meant to be and the circumstance I'm meant to be in right now, and I have to trust that this is the right place and the right time for me and the power comes from what am I doing with this? What am I doing with this moment? So, for me, the trust is very much about trusting my I was going to say trusting my ability to be, to do the best with this moment that I can, which, yes, that kind of that feels right. But there's something else for me in, I think in just not giving yourself a hard time about things, you should be something better or, you know, getting ahead of yourself or thinking things should be different, that's a betrayal of your trust in yourself.
Speaker 2:I think when you're doing that and again, we all do it, you know but to actually really keep saying, yeah, right, in this moment, I'm doing great, even if you're curled up in the fetal position under the duna crying, that's just what I need, I'm doing great. I'm just doing great right now. Actually, what I need to be doing screaming at my kids, exactly right, it's like this, this is this moment, or maybe I could. Maybe, in this moment, if I actually stop and take a breath, there's something, there's a better way that I could meet this moment. Yeah, to really have a relationship with yourself in that way, I think's the most important thing.
Speaker 1:Yeah, of everything, really, really okay, you've uh, I'm part of your um human design membership. Love your design? Yeah what? And I love it, and sometimes I feel like I'm completely in over my head and I have no idea what's going on, but I keep coming back. I think that one of your, one of your phrases is the more I know, the less I know the less I know, the less I yeah, the less I realize I know. Yeah, um, but um, or the more.
Speaker 1:I realize, I don't know yeah, the more I realize I don't know um what are your hopes, desires, goals, dreams? Yeah, where do you see it leading, or where is it right now?
Speaker 2:It was very much a legacy project for me in terms of, like I said at the start, that sense of actually having a human design education where people could learn to read the chart and own the knowledge, um, and be able to then work with it in a really much more empowered way. Um, so I did. I don't. I, I maybe I'm unaware of elsewhere where that happens, but I I haven't. I don't see that happening in the way that I do it like really anchoring back into the four esoteric systems and using those as a guide and that kind of stuff. So that, as a legacy thing, that was really important to me. I wanted to set it up. So I mean, I've actually had complaints from people who say it's too cheap. I mean I've actually had complaints from people who say it's too cheap, but I deliberately set it up that way because I felt that we were going to go through some tough years and I wanted people to be able to access it, and often human design stuff is really really expensive.
Speaker 1:And.
Speaker 2:I don't think that. I just don't see why it should be, and so I wanted to make it available to people in an affordable way. So that was important to me in this time. It was important to me to do that and I just would I mean, it's two and a half years in and the people who are there are just extraordinary, amazing people who have just helped me so much to take what I know and make it practical and available. So I feel a bit teary about thinking about that, like how incredibly supportive that's been for the project as a whole and for me and, um, what I would like to see is, um, just more people engaging with that in in the sense of stepping away from wanting someone else to tell them what their human design is and understanding how to own and empower their own understanding of it.
Speaker 1:Yeah, well, I absolutely love it. It's one of my favorite things to do um, I still don't really know how to describe human design to anyone who asked me what it is.
Speaker 2:I, I am bad at that. Really good thing, I went to a co that co-working me oh, you did okay, and and I'd been part of that group before. But right at the start they say, like tell me what you do and do I hate that question or what? Because like I just, I just am bad at describing what human design is. I'm so bad at it.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and yeah, you could either completely overwhelm someone or you can just make it sound like something that's not really boring. Yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and the other thing I had to say was well, I know it sounds really like woo-hoo, what is it Woo-woo? I know it sounds really woo-woo, what is it woohoo? I know it sounds really woohoo, but it's actually really practical. I'm kind of apologizing for myself in the meeting oh, dear um, but yeah, can't.
Speaker 1:Can't recommend it enough to anyone who is um seeking to learn more about human design and and live more in alignment with who they are in a really supportive community. That's the thing.
Speaker 2:It's like, ah, everyone's so kind and supportive and you've been travelling around the world and meeting up with each other, which I also love, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1:Well, we went to the Human Design Conference last year and that was one of the well, not the only thing thing, but one thing that really stood out for me was that everyone was just like yeah, so accepting of yeah and we had our lanyards on with our like our charts. So people go oh, you're a manifesting generator, oh you're a projector. And it's like total acceptance, it's like I can be exactly who I who I am, and that's that's annie and amber right.
Speaker 2:That's the environment that they created there. It was just beautiful and looking forward to this year as well, same yeah, so thank you so much.
Speaker 1:We're gonna um, we've got your um, uh, you in the guest directory so people can find you. Thank you so much for joining me. It's been a pleasure.
Speaker 2:Thanks, nadine. Great, that was a great discussion. I like that you pulled those particular things out, but you also know what I love talking about.
Speaker 1:Thanks, Kim, before you go, can I ask you a small favor? If you've enjoyed this show or any of the other episodes that you've listened to, then I'd really appreciate it if you took a couple of moments to hit subscribe. This is a great way to increase our listeners and get the word out there about all of the wonderful guests that we've had on the podcast. Get the word out there about all of the wonderful guests that we've had on the podcast. If you'd like to further support the show, you can buy me a coffee by going to buymeacoffeecom forward slash, life, health, the universe. You can find that link in the show notes. Thanks for listening.